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Thread: Policy Meeting Jan. 14 on transgender bathrooms

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by middlein87 View Post
    I don't understand why the policy makers and these advocates only acknowledge/honor the feelings of this fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of the population.
    I take offense at anyone's statement that we, as a society, don't advocate for and give aid to the least of us. Isn't that one of the bedrock principles of Christianity? Isn't that one of the benchmarks for an enlightened society? Isn't that a principle that is embodied by the very Pledge of Allegiance to our country? (Even if some groups do not participate)

    Please tell me you aren't complaining about our Pledge of Allegiance, our Flag and our Homes?????

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by GE Love View Post
    I take offense at anyone's statement that we, as a society, don't advocate for and give aid to the least of us. Isn't that one of the bedrock principles of Christianity? Isn't that one of the benchmarks for an enlightened society? Isn't that a principle that is embodied by the very Pledge of Allegiance to our country? (Even if some groups do not participate)

    Please tell me you aren't complaining about our Pledge of Allegiance, our Flag and our Homes?????
    We do take care of those who need it-handicap access is a great example. Bathroom access is a bit of a different situation. Some people are just uncomfortable/don't understand with the idea of gender dysphoria. Labeling them as haters or worse doesn't help the conversation. In the past 30 years, this country has made some pretty significant positive strides in accepting alternative lifestyles, but we can't force others to think exactly like you would want them to.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clamato View Post
    Exactly.
    It's not "exactly".


    There will be more bathroom users upset by someone of the opposite sex waltzing in than there would be transgender kids upset by having to take a crap in a bathroom that doesn't acknowledge their gender confusion. Anyone denying that is either off their nut or lying. So if we're all about weighing the feelings of our kiddos, the scale is bottomed out on one side of the equation.

  4. #19
    Forum Regular Minnesoter's Avatar
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    Hey, I bet my 5 year old son would be upset about a guy dressed like a woman using the urinal next to him. But, like you said, it would be such a rare occurrence that I don't really give a toss.

    He also gets upset when I put sauce on his spaghetti.

    I, for one, have never looked at anyone's genitalia when in a public bathroom. So, maybe I've crossed paths with a transgender person in a public bathroom. I don't make eye contact. Not sure what you folks who oppose this measure do that gets you so creeped out (or creeped out on behalf of children that you don't have in district 87).
    Last edited by Minnesoter; 01-15-2019 at 03:54 PM.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    Some people are just uncomfortable/don't understand with the idea of gender dysphoria.
    Not arguing with you on your points (They are very good points). My question would be "If not now, when?" People in this country were not comfortable with eating at the same restaurant as an african american person. People were not comfortable with women voting. People were not comfortable with providing access and inclusive education to special needs children. People were not comfortable with same gender marriage.

    I certainly don't expect anyone else but me to hold this opinion, but fear of the unknown, or uncomfortable feelings about a group of people should not be a reason for denial of access or rights. I don't label those people as haters, just fearful. Ackerman's post indicated his level of fear of this subject far outweighs his ability to frame the debate in any kind of non-inflammatory way. I would typically respond to his hateful diatribe in a like minded way. But, this is a newer, kinder, gentler Forum in 2019.

  6. #21
    Forum All Star middlein87's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minnesoter View Post

    I, for one, have never looked at anyone's genitalia when in a public bathroom. So, maybe I've crossed paths with a transgender person in a public bathroom. I don't make eye contact. Not sure what you folks who oppose this measure do that gets you so creeped out (or creeped out on behalf of children that you don't have in district 87).
    Not that it matters to the validity of my point, but I actually do have a graduate of D87, a kid in D87 and a kid who will soon enter D87. Does that make me qualified?

    So, per your post about your 5 year old son, someone of the opposite sex walking into a bathroom is indeed upsetting for others in that bathroom. We agree on that. What I don't get is why you are so cavalier and dismissive of the feelings of the many in support of the admittedly very few.
    Last edited by middlein87; 01-15-2019 at 04:11 PM.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by GE Love View Post
    a reason for denial of access or rights. .
    Easy, Ms. Parks. There's no denial of access or rights here. This is not a separate but equal (but not really) thing. They can take a ****. They can take a piss. They just have to do it in a bathroom for the people with the parts they've got.

  8. #23
    Forum Regular Minnesoter's Avatar
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  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by GE Love View Post
    Not arguing with you on your points (They are very good points). My question would be "If not now, when?" People in this country were not comfortable with eating at the same restaurant as an african american person. People were not comfortable with women voting. People were not comfortable with providing access and inclusive education to special needs children. People were not comfortable with same gender marriage.

    I certainly don't expect anyone else but me to hold this opinion, but fear of the unknown, or uncomfortable feelings about a group of people should not be a reason for denial of access or rights. I don't label those people as haters, just fearful. Ackerman's post indicated his level of fear of this subject far outweighs his ability to frame the debate in any kind of non-inflammatory way. I would typically respond to his hateful diatribe in a like minded way. But, this is a newer, kinder, gentler Forum in 2019.
    The only hate being displayed here is from you. You don't like me. Big whip. Wonder how you'd feel if the guy in the picture in post #23, pulled up next to your spouse in the bathroom. Love might not be so loving.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by ackerman View Post
    Wonder how you'd feel if the guy in the picture in post #23, pulled up next to your spouse in the bathroom.
    She would not be afraid, like you are. Fear holds you back Ack. Eliminate the fear of the unknown and see what a giant world we have. Continuing down your fearful, narrow minded path only limits you.
    Remember, we are talking about a person, not someone intent on nefarious reasons for entering a bathroom.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by middlein87 View Post
    Easy, Ms. Parks. There's no denial of access or rights here.
    Isn't this why Ack went to the meeting and why he is fearfully presenting his caveman beliefs here? He wants to deny this group the right to live the way they believe.
    How would you differentiate between this and racism?

  12. #27
    Forum All Star jombl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GE Love View Post
    How would you differentiate between this and racism?



  13. #28
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    Thanks for the clip of the best movie ever made. Still doesn't answer the question.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by middlein87 View Post
    What I don't get is why you are so cavalier and dismissive of the feelings of the many in support of the admittedly very few.
    I was raised in a Catholic home that advocated for sticking up for marginalized people.

    Obviously, you don't believe that transgenderism is real, as you've stated that these people are simply confused, which is literally the definition of gaslighting. "You don't actually think you're part of the opposite sex, you're just confused." Sounds a lot like what people say when they advocate for conversion therapy for homosexuals, which amazingly, is still a legal thing in our country.

    But besides that, in this specific situation, it's because the most frequent argument I've heard against accommodating transgenders in this bathroom quandary are all along the lines of "but this will open up the gates to our kids being sexually assaulted by these deviant people" which is absurd. I mean really, what is preventing an actual perv from assaulting our kids in bathrooms right now? Is it because they're afraid of going into a room that has an icon of the opposite sex on it, and as soon as they're allowed to go in the "other" door, then all hell will break loose?

    Regardless, I do respect the need for privacy in the bathroom, though my kids do not. Isn't the simple solution to just create a building code that mandates a small private unisex bathroom, that all genders can use (and lock)? They have "family style" lockable small bathrooms at roadstops, which I prefer to use when I bring my young guys in to relieve themselves.

    My own public bathroom rant is this: More diaper changing stations in men's bathrooms please. It's shocking how many public men's bathrooms don't have a changing table, but practically all women's do.
    Last edited by Minnesoter; 01-17-2019 at 11:43 AM.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minnesoter View Post

    Regardless, I do respect the need for privacy in the bathroom, though my kids do not. Isn't the simple solution to just create a building code that mandates a small private unisex bathroom, that all genders can use (and lock)? They have "family style" lockable small bathrooms at roadstops, which I prefer to use when I bring my young guys in to relieve themselves.
    This would be one fix (although lockable doors on high school kids bathrooms is probably a no-no) - perhaps an "in use" sign with the understanding that the campus cop or random admin/faculty member can pop in to make sure a group of kids aren't passing around the one hitter. Heck I recall our high school bathrooms had the individual stall doors removed to make catching the smokers a bit easier. I imagine with vape-ing it's even harder to tell these days.

    Another fix would be to go to No-sex bathrooms, although that would probably cause even more uproar.

    My argument has never been about the assault concern. It's been about subordinating/ignoring/discounting/demonizing the feelings of the majority (or at least plurality) of other students.

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